AIArchitect

Hello just thought I'd say hello, this is my first time using any kind of forum. I'm 25 from Sydney Australia, been training for about 4 years, pretty hard for the past year and a half. I'm about 5'8 and weigh 101kg currently bulking and hoping to compete earliest May 2010 as a novice. My main aim is to come in as conditioned as possible, this will be hard as I have never done this and I'm pretty scared/nervous but I know I can do it. So yeah that's a bit about me thanks for reading
Quads

I stand corrected in the second to last paragraph above. "If Mr. Obama would give even larger tax CUTS to everyone, including those of us who create jobs, the markets would recover overnight.
I mispelled "recommend" as well above.

One last point on the matter: The same thing happening in the Great Depression is happening now and that is that government is interjecting itself into a problem, that it helped to create. I believe that this crap economy will only be prolonged due to this now 7 TRILLION dollar bailout. Why aren't the government officials that allowed Fannie and Freddie take over loans to poor people that they knew couldn't pay them back, not in jail. Why aren't the financial leaders who then bundled these mortgages and sold them as class A rated investments to people around the world, not in jail for fraud or money laundering? My god, the same people who have created this mess, are now in control of fixing it, ans so far it has been a shambles. See ya'll in the soup line!!

For those that are curious, my name is pronounced Connie, it's just spelled wierd.

Great posts and I enjoyed the history lesson above, even though I disagree with a lot of it.

The one thing that caused the Great Depression was the Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act. I would argue that the 1929 crash was a cyclical downward cycle of the market, as proven previously before 1929. S-HTA was a reaction by our government to "protect" the market by taxing all imports. This strangled global trade and caused the global downturn that led to the Great Depression. The New Deal only exacerbated the problems and did not help overcome them. I would like to put a hypothesis out there: Did the shrinking global market, caused by the US govt's tarrif act, give Japan the right to invade China for Oil and other imports, that they so desperately needed, and then attack the US as retaliation for trying to destroy their economy? Government usually creates problems, then tries to fix them, and they create more problems in the fix! It's crazy!

I read Forbes and I reccomend everyone read it to gain a true understanding of the G.D. and not some college marxist view of it.

Before the 1920's government took little or no action in stock crashes. Why? Because before the Great Depression, thrift, limited government, balanced budgets, the gold std., and Say's Law were all enforced. Most economists defended these ideals on a micro-economic scale, but rejected these ideals on a macro-economic scale. Once the advocation of consumption over saving, fiat money over the gold std., deficit spending over balanced budgets, active state interventionism over limited govt. occured, our economy was doomed to fail. Keynesianism and demand side economics over supply side free market economics, led to the welfare state and boundless faith in BIG GOVT.

According to Milton Freidman, a 1960's economist who researched the G.D., in addition to Smoot Hawley, the Federal Reserve caused the G.D. How? As gold stock rose, the Fed perversely raised the discount rate, which caused money supplies to dwindle and banks collapsed. Again, Government is the problem.

Fast forward to the New New Deal and all these government sanctioned ineffiecient programs were started. Namely the Social Security Administration. I will concede that the primary idea was a good one for this plan. But now it is nothing but a program that is contnuously raped by our politicians for more waste and pork. I'm waiting to see if Prez Obama entitles illegal aliens to receive benefits. He said he would. I'm paying money into something I will never see. I want the choice to take my money out of the system and invest it myself.

So how does all this affect Architects? Well according to Congressman Barney Frank, the defecit doesn't matter, the govt keeps bailing out people, and I keep hearing the same arguments that I read about the Great Depression. Our politicians are not students of history, but are only in it to control, we the people. Our economy sucks because of government intervention and I agree with Dave,Dale and Shawn.

Many believe that the economy is a zero sum game: when one dollar is spent, one dollar is taken away. It is not a zero sum game: when one dollar is spent, it is invested and creates more dollars. It's not rocket science. If President Elect Obama would come out right now and say that he will lower cap gains taxes, give even larger taxes TO EVERYONE, including those of us who create jobs, the markets would recover overnight. Have NO MORE bailouts!! Chapter 11 bankruptcy is there for a reason. It is a legal bailaout. People are already losing jobs even with the bailout, so why not let people reorganize with the legal option.

I am so frustrated with the ignorant politicians we have in office, that I want to pull my hair out. But the American public elected them and we get what we vote for.

I find this a very interesting string of comments, and I commend all for keeping to a respectful exchange of ideas versus dropping into insult and name calling as many of our politicians tend to do. I guees I am pretty middle of the road. I think that government can and does do many things well. Frankly, how much great architecture would there be in the world without governmental support? Now is a good time for government to do some of those big projects that no private entity will. On the other hand, I think the government should be as minimally involved in our personal lifes as possible, and that includes make-work programs. However, we need big government to protect us from the abuses of the powerful. In that group I include both big business and the big unions. We need a reasonable amount of regulation. For example. from the impartial reports I have seen, the failure of the mortgage system was partially to blame on government sponsored efforts to open credit markets to a broader range of the population. The biggest cause was the way the banks and mortgage companies agressively pushed a program based on bad credit risk, counting on the free-market to self-regulate the greed. Free market capitalism is a myth when an individual is up against an unregulated multi-billion dollar company.

As asked above, what does this mean for architects and the AIA. As stated, individually and as firms, we need to do our jobs well. For the AIA, I don't think I want them representing me politically. I also belong to several other trade groups and such seemingly inoquous groups as the AAA. Many of them have a political agenda (such as promoting use of the car)that has nothing to do with why I joined (getting a jumpstart when my battery is dead). We all got our chance to vote, let's leave the politics with each of us individually and the AIA can stick to representing our professional interests rather than promoting a political agenda.

Thanks Kahne, for pointing out what is too often willfully overlooked: that a mix of government and private actions led to a depression, but it took purely government action to make it a Great Depression. And what’s worse, government policies made it last far longer than it would otherwise have lasted. If you owned a small construction company, could you have competed against the federal WPA for a building job? Not a chance. As long as it (and other programs) lasted, economic recovery was stifled. If one believes that economic collapse is a precursor for good public architecture, there are failed states the world over in which to try your hand. Have at it! Let me know how it goes.

This is being repeated in our current age with the financial “crisis”. It is important to remember that the failure of the Government Sponsored Enterprises (GSE) Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were entirely the result of years of government meddling in the realm of mortgage loans, actually forcing a lowering of underwriting standards. It was not deregulation of the private sphere, but a lack of regulation of quasi-government institutions that is at the heart of the current troubles. The rest of the domino effect was similarly set in motion. Partisans like to attribute this collapse to a failure of the free market, but it is actually the failure of government to allow the free market to function.
So, once again, regardless of the good intentions of those responsible, government systematically creates a problem, and the same folks are coming up with expensive plans to fix it. Here's how we got into this mess. As usual, the taxpayers are the biggest losers.

So, what does this mean for architecture and engineering? Let’s do our jobs well, adding value to our clients so that they can prosper and hire more workers. Let’s design needed infrastructure made to last and perform for generations. Let’s build efficiently and sustainably with an eye toward reducing the need for resources and minimizing (eliminating?) operating cost and energy usage. But let us never look to government hand-outs and “stimulus” packages in the form of bloated, misguided spending to move us forward. Ever wonder where the money comes from for those spending sprees? The effects are entirely predictable.

(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs&feature=related)

BACKGROUND

It is interesting to see politcized points of view about the recovery tactics deployed by this nation following the great depression. I would guess that like myself you are not speaking from direct experience and are estranged from those events by time and socially acquired norms.

A brief history precedes my contribution to your discussion:
The market collapsed in 1929 and wiped out 40% of the paper value of the common stock, only 25% of the american work force had employment by 1932 and by 1933 the value of the common stock was only one fifth of what it had been.

There was a huge gap between the countries productive capacity and the ability of people to consume, although productive capacity had increased after the first world war wages did not keep pace, manufactured goods were simply in greater supply than wage earners could buy.

President Hoover took office just prior to the collapse of the markets. Roosevelt defeated him in the next election and argued then as must be argued now that the economic tragedy arose from underlying flaws in the system. Republican philosophy had failed demonstrably.

So Roosevelt argued that federal authority was desired to bring about change and Hoover running for re-election argued to stay the course. Roosevelt crushed Hoover in the election ushering in a new era of economic and political change.

President Roosevelt immediately implemented radical change called the New Deal, which somewhat mimicked or cloned aspects of European socialism. At the center was the abandonment of "laissez-faire" capitalism. The banking system was in a state of paralysis, banks were closed and reopened only if they were solvent. Hundreds of thousands roamed the country looking for work. So relief was brought by a congressional act to create the Civilian Conservation Corps or the (CCC) to young men between 18 and 25 years of age. They set up work camps across the U.S. The Civil Works Administration still being criticized by conservative as "make work" ranged from highway maintenance tasks to teaching, it was abandoned in 1934.

So greater regulation was seen as a path to solving the nations problems. Farmers were granted relief and often paid to voluntarily cut back production and between 1932 and 1935 farm income increased by 50%. The drought that produced the "Dust Bowl" in Arkansas, Texas, and Oklahoma displaced almost a million people. However by 1940 significant recovery was underway.

The National Recovery Administration passed the NIRA "National Industrial Recovery Act", NRA was established in 1933 and was aimed at ending cut-throat competition by setting codes of fair practice. Business owners complained bitterly as these codes reduced the extent to which they could exploit labor for profit. Although declared unconstitutional in 1935 the NRA policies did foster substantial recovery by generating more jobs and empowering working people to buy more.

Organized labor expanded under the New Deal. This was a good thing. Greater gains were made than ever before in American History the NIRA had guaranteed labor the right to collective bargaining. It defined unfair labor practices and established the National Labor Relations Board to supervise bargaining, administer elections and ensure workers the right to pick the non profit organization that would represent them in dealing with employers.

This act alone can be credited with substantial impact on the recovery of the nations economy from the depression, which was largely triggered by wage suppression in the first place.

Labor also acquired at that time a significant voice in politics. Organized labor is good because job protection is essential as the backbone of the American economy.

The Second New Deal attended upon the early efforts, as immediate problems eased new one emerged. Roosevelt backed a new set of social and economic reinforcement measures. The legislative birth place of the war on poverty was coupled with efforts to counter unemployment with work and a social safety net.

Thus was born the WPA or Works Progress Administration. Buildings, roads & schools were built. A federal theater and art project which included writers, musicians and painters and even pert time work for students with training programs. hard to see the downside from where many architects are today. WPA only included 3 million people at a time and by 1943 had substantially helped about 9 million people.

The Second New Deal created Social Security to function as it's safety net. Social Security was an insurance program run as a nonprofit structure by the federal government as a way of taking care of the aged, unemployed and disabled. The calls for this program by the progressives in prior to the depression had been ignored.

From the beginning conservatives complained about Social Security as being alien to their fantasy concerning American traditions. in reality Social Security was and remains a necessary and conservative financial safety net for the American worker. It was and is funded by taxes with a single fixed rate regardless of income. Today it is one of the largest domestic programs in existence and is absolutely essential to the political stability of the nation.

In 1936 Roosevelt won the election to a second term. His victory was even more decisive than in 1932. These were the grass roots of the current democratic party, which remained effective until the late 1960's when the party largely imploded into a collection of special interests.

The election meant that the people wanted government to take greater responsibility for the welfare of the nation. It was argued then as now that big government would undermine the liberties of the people and constrain democracy.

In other nations democracy had been sacrificed in exchange for getting something to eat and someplace to dwell. Roosevelt pointed out that Americans were in agreement in the necessity of defending their liberties at any cost and that the first line of defense was to protect the economic security of the people.

FOREGROUND

We now face a new problem laced with similarity to the depression. This time economic stability is undermined by bad domestic conservative policy that has again created a circumstance where American workers cannot make enough money to buy the things being produced and American companies cannot sell enough to stay in business. largely this is due to external economic forces of change, goods and services from cheap labor nations have flooded the American marketplace with low priced replacements of things we used to make ourselves. Generating competition over price that American industry cannot engage and sustain.

China for example has an average wage of $1.50 per hour. American workers are called upon to sacrifice their lifestyles to sustain the fantasy of free trade with autocratic societies engaged in the effective equivalent of slave labor.

I have the outsource offers here in my office, in front of me now for my consideration, from China and I am faced with a decision knowing there is no way any employee here could ever compete with the prices there and the offer on my desk. The stores from dry goods to hardware are filled with goods made there that used to be made here by people with good family supporting jobs. We are selling our souls and betraying the sacrifices of generations of hero's, to keep our businesses operating until we ourselves are replaced by the same devastating systemic flaw in the free enterprise system.

The Democratic goals of Architecture is of little significance compared to the need of a new architecture of government that will empower the American Labor and American Capitalists to defend our liberties against massive economic impact from external sources, we must protect democracy at any cost and that the first line of defense was and remains the responsibility to protect the economic security of the people.

We must put Amerca's architects back to work. The means eliminate the black market for architectural services and not to create one.

We can start by making federal law that requires that an Architect's stamp be placed on every technical submission for permit following a review by the architect. This would create two levels of review on every new building; this would empower implementation of sustainable building technologies at a more rapid pace. This legislation simple to enact and prudent at this time would reduce the risk and uncertainty for construction lenders and insurers. This would be of great benefit to our profession but of greater benefit to construction investment and would draw dollars back to the AEC industrial complex.

We must restore & rebuild the American capacity to capitalize construction projects and engage in manufacturing and retail business on a sound foundation. Competition with slave labor nations will continue to manifest the nightmare that spawned the cold war. Government projects may be a good place to "make work" , that may be necessary as we must adapt, but in the end it all has to be self sustaining.

SIDE NOTE

Free enterprise favors those who have the closest equivalent to free labor, it is an enduring power vacuum that sucks dollars from here overseas, where those dollars earned here make the enemies of our democracy the masters of communism wealthy and powerful beyond comprehension. there is great danger in ignoring this, or believing democracy will survive it by doing nothing to stop it, mathematically there can be no self regulating adjustment.

TLW

Being newly licensed, I hadn't realized how liberal the AIA was until I read this. Especially the line about the lobbying for the infrastructure aspect of the stimulus package. The comment left by O'banion was far better than the article written. and the the good sirs point, the stimulus package, corporate bailouts, and bigger government will only prolong this "recession". It's appearant to me that the AIA is in desperate need of new, logical (read conservative) leadership.

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a different vision of the future:

middleburyinstitute.org/caseforamericansecession.html

Thanks Kahne, for pointing out what is too often willfully overlooked: that a mix of government and private actions led to a depression, but it took purely government action to make it a Great Depression. And what’s worse, government policies made it last far longer than it would otherwise have lasted. If you owned a small construction company, could you have competed against the federal WPA for a building job? Not a chance. As long as it (and other programs) lasted, economic recovery was stifled. If one believes that economic collapse is a precursor for good public architecture, there are failed states the world over in which to try your hand. Have at it! Let me know how it goes.

This is being repeated in our current age with the financial “crisis”. It is important to remember that the failure of the Government Sponsored Enterprises (GSE) Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were entirely the result of years of government meddling in the realm of mortgage loans, actually forcing a lowering of underwriting standards. It was not deregulation of the private sphere, but a lack of regulation of quasi-government institutions that is at the heart of the current troubles. The rest of the domino effect was similarly set in motion. Partisans like to attribute this collapse to a failure of the free market, but it is actually the failure of government to allow the free market to function.
So, once again, regardless of the good intentions of those responsible, government systematically creates a problem, and the same folks are coming up with expensive plans to fix it. Here's how we got into this mess. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs&feature=related) As usual, the taxpayers are the biggest losers.

So, what does this mean for architecture and engineering? Let’s do our jobs well, adding value to our clients so that they can prosper and hire more workers. Let’s design needed infrastructure made to last and perform for generations. Let’s build efficiently and sustainably with an eye toward reducing the need for resources and minimizing (eliminating?) operating cost and energy usage. But let us never look to government hand-outs and “stimulus” packages in the form of bloated, misguided spending to move us forward. Ever wonder where the money comes from for those spending sprees? The effects are entirely predictable.

The only problem with all of the government created jobs programs during the great depression was that it made the depression last longer, because capital was taken out of the market and created a vaccum that pulled down investment, thus negating a quicker recovery. The only reason why the WPA was dismantled was that WWII began and the government moved money/capital back into the private sector through the factories building war machines, etc. Everyone had a private sector job, so in 1943 WPA was dismantled, but many good projects happened and many bad projects occured.

I know this may sound simplistic, but in South Lousisana there were some really UGLY, inefficient buildings and structures that were built by the WPA. Many have since been torn down to make room for green structures. In Biloxi, the sea wall that has protected the coast from many hurricanes, was a great thing and had it not been there during Katrina, things would have been much worse. Look, the AIA needs to support public Architecture and Infrastructure, and I don't disagree with that, but what I do disagree with is creating a "work welfare" program for projects that can be done a whole hell of a lot cheaper, greener, and more design worthy than what a burrecrat can come up with. The major factor I can see creating these public projects to be boondoggles, is the labor factor. The WPA was notorious for the fact that there was no incentive to work, because everyone was guaranteed a top prevailing wage whether the project was finished or not. Jobs weren't based on ability and termination wasn't even considered for a bad job. Last Saturday I watched "To Kill a Mockingbird", on T.V. I remember the line about Bob, the resident slacker, who was described as "the only person to get fired from the WPA for laziness." The joke at the time was that WPA equated to "We Poke Along". Get the labor unions involved and nothing would get done, except that the fat cats at the top would pocket good money. Hell the AFL-CIO is structured like that now. The US Postal Service is a primary example of government jobs not being terminated because of bad job performance. I have an acquaintance that works there, who calls in sick two day a week, and they can't fire her because of Union regulation. What a crock. Our tax dollars not working.

America has infrastructure problems, no doubt about it. Our taxes are high in Texas, and some of our roads are still horrible. With the exorbitant fuel tax that supposedly fixes roads, I expect better repair and replacement. Where does all that money go that the Federal Government collects from each one of us that fill up our gas tanks? Every time I drive over a bridge, I think about how old it may be and if it is disrepair. But our local and state governments do a wonderful job with what they have, but there is so much to do! I think that waste in spending is the main problem. The U.S. already has entities in place in each state, we don't need another federal bureacracy to create more jobs. If in America, our Congress would let us drill for more oil, build more refineries, build more power plants, invest in alternative fuels, and alternative transportation, we could create millions of jobs in the private sector, that would require Architects and where more taxes would be paid into the government. More investment could be made by "Joe Sixpack" through our 401k's, real estate, etc. The economy would be on a roll.

The role of Architects and Government is to protect U.S. citizens from any foe. We have had bridges collapse, natural disasters, and violent attacks and both entities have provided the protection that we required. There has to be a middle ground to the solutions we have to design and not just some program created. We need to treat our exploration for alternative fuels, cars, energy, etc. like a war and go all out into attacking research and investment in private sector solutions and create many "Rosie the Riveters" in our quest for economic stability. Americans, especially Architects, must depend upon ourselves to get it done and not some program that would extend this downward economic spiral that we find ourselves in at the moment. Yes we can!!